HAWKEYE: Could Laura Barton Be Revealed As The MCU's Take On Mockingbird? SPOILERS

@bkmeijer - that's interesting. Maybe Clint knows of someone who is close to Fisk

@LSHF - Pineapple on pizza?!

@SpaceAgent - Oh boy, this takes me back. When Avengers came out, there were a lot of people who were totally convinced Coulson would be brought back to life as Vision. They had a lot of evidence that this would happen, most (if not all) of it completely made up.

@clornelas - "moleface"

@Nightwing1015 - Same actors, same characters, but I guarantee they won't be referencing anything that happened on those shows.

@Nightwing1015 - with Loki introducing variants, I'm pretty sure that everything from Marvel Television is all considered variant stories.

@Nightwing1015 - That Matt Murdock is a variant of the Netflix one

Marvel Studios will take what worked from those shows and ignore or replace what didn't

You can argue that those shows/events happened in the multiverse, but they didn't in the main timeline. Which is why even to this day, shows like AoS, Runaways and Inhumans are still labeled "Marvel Legacy" on Disney Plus, along with the Fox-men properties

@RorMachine - "Same actors, same characters, but I guarantee they won't be referencing anything that happened on those shows."

The actors are inherently a reference to what happened on those shows. A story doesn't have to be referenced explicitly to be canon. Things are often streamlined for accessibility, but that doesn't inherently imply contradiction or erasure.

I don't expect Matt to recount the 3 seasons of Daredevil in detail, but a vague, simple allusion to his past conflicts with Fisk is enough for fans of the show to see these new stories as a continuation while not forcing people to watch the older stories to follow the new ones.

If it is not explicitly explained in-story or stated by Marvel Studios that these are new versions (variants) of the Matt and Fisk we've seen, it makes more sense than not to view them as the same characters.

@OmegaDaGrodd - Exactly! We've seen them recast (Banner, Rhodey). We've seen them reuse actors within the same continuity (Gemma Chan) We've seen them essentially "re-tone" a character in the case of Thor.

If we can accept appearance changes, doppelgängers, and shifts in personality, I think it's silly to cry "non-canon" and "variant" if Charlie Cox's Daredevil is presented a bit differently and doesn't explicitly reference everything we've seen happen to him.

It is entirely possible that we will get some sort of retcon or declaration that the shows are alternate canon, and I can admit that. However, it feels like people of the opposing view have committed themselves so fully to this idea that even as evidence seems to suggest the contrary, they are unwilling to say "Oh, maybe I was wrong. Let's wait and see what happens."

@lordSTALE - You seem confused by what you're quoting from me, which is weird because I'm pretty sure we've already had this conversation.

Until Feige actually says "those shows that used to be in the MCU are actually not canon to the MCU anymore" there's not really anything to discuss. Feige's comments about the Disney+ shows are very obviously referring to the fact that the events of these shows will actually follow on into the movies (unlike any of the pre D+ shows did) which is what it means to truly be "interlinked". What their words don't say at all is if the previous shows are still canon anymore, and judging by the fact that we've now seen them pull characters/castings from both ABC and Netflix, we've got more actual evidence in favor of them being canon than we do of them not

And that's fine. Feige can easily say that this Daredevil isn't the one from Netflix, which is a super easy distinction to put into words and not prone to any differing interpretations

@lordSTALE -

"You can twist yourself into knots doing these mental gymnastics"

Kevin Feige (or even Nate Moore) don't even say the words "Netflix" or "canon" in any quote you provided, and are actively casting actors from Netflix shows to play the same characters in current Marvel movies, so I'm not sure how gymnastics factor into waiting on them to clarify any of this. Feige's actions with Hawkeye/NWH and your interpretations of his quotes don't line up, and pretending you don't see a clear discrepancy is actually a much better example of "twisting yourself into knots".

If you want to take high level quotes about Disney+ shows and value them over Feige literally plucking characters from Netflix shows and putting them in current MCU projects, that is totally your prerogative, but I'm not sure why you're acting so weird about other people patiently waiting for some basic clarity

@lordSTALE -

"Kevin Feige and Nate Moore both said that with the Disney Plus shows FOR THE FIRST TIME, the shows would be connected to the MCU movies"

As I've already stated (and Kevin Feige already noted) the connection between the new movies and the D+ shows work both ways now, which is entirely different than how they worked before. That has nothing to do with what is "canon" or not, which is why you can't produce a quote of either of them talking about the Netflix and ABC shows no longer having any canonical connection to the films. Kevin Feige in 2015 already noted the shows and the movies were "connected" just in one direction because their production timelines don't allow for a seamless back and forth

https://themarvelreport.com/2015/09/kevin-feige-confirms-marvel-tv-film-connection/

So, putting "FOR THE FIRST TIME" in all caps is probably something you should stop doing since he's clearly already acknowledged that they've been connected since AoS first came out (in 2013) and he's already stated that this D+ "connection" will be different (flowing both ways). Again, if Feige comes out tomorrow and says the old shows events have been retconned out of the MCU, that's totally fine. But pretending there's only one way to interpret Feige's comments even tho your interpretation clearly contradicts Feige's own original words only shows that you're too immature to even slightly soften your stance.....or you're pretending to believe what you're saying 100%, which both seem like strange ways to engage in a discussion

"Even Charlie Cox has stated that it wouldn't be the exact same Matt Murdock from the Netflix, therefore being a variant as we understand it"

Charlie Cox at no point has said that if he came back in the MCU, he'd be from a different timeline than the one in the Netflix show. There are pretty clear guidelines for what constitutes a variant, so I'm again wondering why you'd pretend even to know what version of DD he's playing (he also said some elements would be the same, and that he views it similar to different writers reimagining characters in different comic runs, which has nothing to do with "variants).

"Fisk will look drastically different and won't be in jail, how's the delusion working all of that out?"

Clint Barton was on house arrest at the beginning of Endgame, committed countless international crimes, and over the course of 5 years and is now taking his kids to a broadway play. But please explain to me how someone as resourceful as Kingpin couldn't escape from jail while half the population had suddenly vanished and that the only reasonable explanation for him being free is that he's a variant.

Again, if you want to let Disney+ labels or quotes that don't even mention the word "canon" tell you what is or isn't canon, that's fine. I'm just going to wait for the guy putting the same casted characters from Netflix shows in current MCU projects clarify things, and I'm going to somehow do that without being a weirdo towards people who would prefer to jump to conclusions based on limited information